The Just Checking In Podcast
The Just Checking In Podcast is another step in VENT’s mission to give people a voice, change the conversation around mental health and provide an outlet where everyone, but especially men and boys, can express themselves. In each pod we check in with a special guest. We have a natter and a chat about all things mental health as well as anything and everything else they're passionate about. If it helps that person with their mental health, we'll discuss it!
The Just Checking In Podcast
JCIP #377 - Danny Grady
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In episode 377 of The Just Checking In Podcast we checked in with Danny Grady.
Danny is part of Mandem Meetup Wolves (MMUW), the Wolverhampton branch of Mandem Meetup, a grassroots charity promoting, correcting and improving the conversation around men’s mental health and wellbeing.
Danny became part of MMUW in February 2024 when he went to his first Mandem Talking Circle. Now he is a facilitator of them.
He also runs the MMUW football team alongside friend of the pod Jamie Hall.
In this episode we first discuss Danny’s mental health journey, where he started smoking weed and drinking from as young as 12 years old.
After turning 18, he started taking stronger, party drugs but it was alcohol which he sadly became addicted to and took hold of his life.
He was drinking every day, on weekends and had to drink as soon as he woke up to ‘level him out’, a hallmark of addiction.
He became a father at just 19 years old but wasn’t present for them whilst in the throes of his addiction.
He reached rock bottom several times, the most difficult period being in 2009 when he temporarily separated from his wife and became suicidal.
He split up with his wife several times after that, quitting temporarily to heal the relationship but just as quickly relapsing and falling back into negative behaviours.
This cycle continued until 2024 when the penny dropped and he began his recovery.
Since then, he has been clean from all drugs and alcohol for two years, and found a new support network that provides him with positivity, not temptations.
In this episode we discuss that journey from addiction to sobriety, fatherhood, becoming a grandfather at 42, his relationship with his wife and the role MMU Wolves has played in his recovery.
As always, #itsokaytovent
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TRIGGER WARNING: this podcast contains a deep discussion about suicide, which some listeners may find distressing or upsetting, so please listen with caution.
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Trigger warning. This podcast contains discussions about suicide, which some listeners may find distressing or upsetting. So please listen with caution. Hi Venters, welcome back to another episode of the Just Checking In Podcast. I'm your host, Freddie Cocker, and this podcast is brought to you by Vent, a place where everyone, but especially men and boys, can open up about their mental health issues, break down stigmas, and start conversations. In each episode, I check in with a special guest. We have a natter and a chat about all things mental health, as well as anything and everything else they are passionate about. If it helps that person with their mental health, we discuss it. My special guest for this episode is Danny Grady. Danny is part of Mandem Meetup Wolves, the Wolverhampton branch of Mandem Meetup, a grassroots charity promoting, correcting and improving the conversation around men's mental health and wellbeing. I've already checked in with the founder and CEO Jamie Dennis twice, and MMU Wolves senior leader Lee Edwards, and they are an organization we support massively here at Vent. I asked Brother Lee for some guest recommendations and he gave me two amazing men. One of those was a man called Jamie Hall, who I've already checked in with, and another was a man called Danny Grady, who I'm checking in with today. Danny became part of MMU Wolves in February 2024 when he went to his first Mandem talking circle. Now he leads them himself. He also runs the MMU Wolves football team alongside Jamie, taking the reins from Lee, and in this episode we first discussed Danny's mental health journey, where he started smoking weed and drinking from as young as 12 years old. After turning 18, he graduated to stronger party drugs, but it was alcohol which he sadly became addicted to and took hold of his life. He was drinking every day, on weekends, and felt he had to drink as soon as he woke up to quote level him out, a hallmark of addiction. He became a father at an early age two at just 19 years old, but he wasn't present for his children whilst he was in the throes of his addiction. He reached rock bottom several times, the most difficult period being in 2009 when he temporarily separated from his wife and became suicidal. He split up with his wife several times after that, quitting the drink temporarily to heal the relationship, but just as quickly falling back into negative behaviours and relapsing. This cycle continued until 2024, when the penny dropped and he began his recovery. That same year he attended his first talking circle at Mandem Meetup Wolves after being recommended it from a friend who saw the pain when he was in and knew he needed peer-to-peer support. Since that moment, he has been cleaned from all drugs and alcohol for two years in counting and found a new social group and support network that provides him with positivity and no temptations to relapse. In this episode, we discussed that journey from addiction to sobriety, fatherhood, recovery, becoming a grandfather at 42 years old, his relationship with his wife and the ups and downs they'd gone through, and the role MMU Wolves has played in his recovery. So this is how my conversation with Danny Grady went. Danny, welcome to the Just Checking In pod. Thank you so much for letting me check in with you, brother. When Brother Lee told me about your journey, how you've turned your life around with the support of Mandem and Mandem Meeter Wolves. I had to get you on and share your story. You've been through some difficult moments recently. We're not going to get into all of that on the podcast, but I appreciate you still doing this, brother. How are you, mate?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I'm good. I'm good considering, you know, I've got a lot of things going on, but I'm in a good space. So yeah, I'm just trying my best to stay on a positive, bro.
SPEAKER_01That's all we can do. That's all we can do. We can only do our best. You've gone through so many mental health experiences. It feels like you've gone through enough for 10 people, let alone one, similar to me sometimes when I think about it. So without further ado, are you ready to start the show and talk all about your amazing journey?
SPEAKER_03Yes, bruh.
SPEAKER_01Let's dive straight in on your podcast, mate, by talking about your mental health journey first, as all the work you do with the Mandem comes from this journey and how you've turned pain into purpose, as I always say. So I asked all my special guests on this topic this question first. I asked it to Jamie D. I asked it to Lee. You know what's coming. Take me back to early life in Wolverhampton, teenagers, and looking back, were there any early mental health experiences, if any? Who's the Danny we meet here?
SPEAKER_03Well, I was from a council estate, so I was sort of initiated into where I went. So uh now mental health as a youngster, I don't think I even knew what it was, bro. But today I'm someone who has recognised mental health more being sober than I did before. Do you know what I mean? Like I've realised about mental health later rather than while it was happening.
SPEAKER_01Let's talk about early teenage years first, mate. So at 12 years old, it's a very early age, even for most lads, you start drinking and you're smoking weed. How did you respond to both of them and how did it impact your childhood and your mental health growing up at that point?
SPEAKER_03My childhood, I was we was from an area where, you know, we looked up to the older guys. So when we started it, it was sort of we were the younger ones, but we was sort of the little shits, and we got in with the older ones, so we started, you know, having a drag of a spliff, drinking, you know, there's probably six of us buying a frigging 10 pound draw, 10 pound weed, and sharing it, you know, and then it just progressed and progressed. But um, yeah, that's how it all began. It was just normal to me, like everything that happened at that age and stuff like that. Now I look at my own children who are 12 years old. I realised they're babies, and that's the scary thing, do you know what I mean? It's uh crazy time, but again, I only realised later in life how crazy it was.
SPEAKER_01Before we talk about how it graduated to addiction, when you turn 18, you start going to pubs legally, you graduate to substances that are beyond alcohol and weed, so more party drugs. However, what was underneath that that caused you to do them to excess? What was behind the pain?
SPEAKER_03I don't think it was the pain, I think it was always wanting to fit in. So again, looking up to people, looking up to the wrong people. So there'd be lads in there who were sniffing, taking ecstasy, like taking pills, going to raves, and I wanted to be a part of that. So, yeah, my thing was always wanting to fit in, but the sad thing was it was the wrong place to be wanting to fit in at that time.
SPEAKER_01We're gonna talk about how those lack of role models then has, I guess, kind of shaped your not just fatherhood journey, but also in the work you do for Mandem and Abitmate. But when it comes to addiction, it was alcohol that was your main vice. When do you think it became a big problem outside of just like youthful exuberance and what all of us lads did when we were sort of 15, 16? And when did you realise as well that it became a problem in the first place?
SPEAKER_03Um, when I sobered up, I realised I I knew it was bad. Do you know what I mean? So I'd go out on vendors and I'd go out and four weekend sessions, and Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, I was in a dark place. I didn't want to be drinking and stuff like that at the start, you know, before it got on to drinking every day, but it was just a time where again it was just the norm. So I'd be talking messages, phone calls with the lads, so it'd be like, Yeah, I feel like shit, man. Come Thursday, we'll be alright, we'll be back at it. And you know, you'd like joke your way through it, and it was my surroundings, it was my circle, it was just everything was uh downfall for me, really. There was no one saying, Why don't you just stop it, my well, apart from my missus, obviously, but I have too many round me just saying, We'll be alright, man, we'll get on it. So in sales out this week, we're doing this, we're doing that, and it was just a vicious circle, bro.
SPEAKER_01You don't want to be left out, do you? You don't have the fear the fear of missing out, but also the fear of being left out as well. It's both at the same time.
SPEAKER_03100%, and that went on way too long in my life. It's being scared to miss out when I was a ground man with children, you know, like it's crazy to think about now.
SPEAKER_01Well, let's talk about fatherhood because in the midst of that addiction, you become a dad for the first time, very young, 19 years old. I've spoken to many lads about fatherhood on this podcast, including ones who were going through mental health challenges at the time that they became a dad, right? And some of them it caused them to wake up, it caused them to start turning their life around, fatherhood specifically here. It didn't happen for you. Why was that, mate?
SPEAKER_03It did happen in another way, like um, so it probably didn't slow like the sessions I was going on there, my drinking and taking drugs, but it did slow down the trouble I was getting into. So people say before I met my wife and that, I was heading nowhere but getting locked up. And when I had my son, I had two things in hand, I was getting into trouble and drinking and taking drugs. I did give one thing up. Do you know what I mean? So to me, I think that was me being a dad, like, yeah, I don't do this no more, I don't do that. But that's just like taking something away, so it's okay what I'm doing, sort of thing. I was making an excuse for myself, I suppose, just thinking about it as I'm talking now. I was probably thinking, I've done that, so I'm not doing anything wrong. I work all week. You know what I mean? What what's wrong with going out for a drinks and doing what I'm doing?
SPEAKER_01You stop getting into trouble, but you're still drinking, right? And you said that you weren't present for your family during that period. What impact do you think that had on your relationship with your wife at the time and obviously your children until you got sober?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, because I was there. I was there, I was in the house. I just wasn't present because I was I was drinking attack exactly, yeah. So I was in the house. Do you know this is the saddest thing, man? It's like I was confusing the kids as well. So I could be a bit merry and a bit jolly, and I'd be play fighting with them, doing this, doing that, messing around, being the fun dad. But then that could switch, I could be the dad who's on kids, so they'd come up to me and give me a little digging in the stomach or something. I'd do, what you're doing, you know, get upstairs, stop messing about all this, and confusing the kid. I wasn't one character. I could either be the fun dad who wanted to this, who wanted to play, who wanted to roll around on the floor, or I could be the dad who was wanted to lie on the sofa, who wanted them out of the room, get to your room. I mean, how confusing is that? That's what saddens me so much about looking back on my journey that fills me with I know we sh we shouldn't look back and I should only be looking forward, but that's a guilt that I do carry, and uh I've spoken to them now about it, you know what I mean. That's something that that I want them to hear this and know that I am genuinely gutted that it went that way.
SPEAKER_01It's really courageous of you to say that, bro, because I've spoken to many people who've had parents with addiction issues, and the one theme that they come back to is unpredictability, right? So they'll say, When I came home from school, I didn't know what dad or mum I was gonna walk into. It could be really jolly, they could be absolutely up for doing things, or they could be in a depressive state, they could be angry, even violent at the most extremes. When did you kind of get that cognizance yourself of what you had done and also move forward like you've done, be better and own it?
SPEAKER_03Um, with me, I was ups and downs. So when I stopped and that I did feel better and I was present and I was doing stuff, and I think those little periods that's what kept my wife around. But my life was a roller coaster, so I'd have times where I did want to stop, I did want to be this man, and then as we spoke about earlier, bump the lads are on the message, we're doing this, we're doing that, and I'm wanting that. I'm wanting to live two completely separate lives, and um they just clashed so often, man, and I suppose I didn't realise only till 42 years of age fully, fully. Obviously, I had my times where I I wanted to change a lot, but just never happened till now.
SPEAKER_01Before we talk about recovery, mate, the darkest moment came in 2009. You had split up with your wife temporarily, you could no longer see your children on a daily basis, and you become suicidal. Who's the Danny we meet at that moment in time, mate?
SPEAKER_03That's when I had no one to go home to, so out sessioning, partying again, I'm okay. I haven't even got a thought of it. I'm laughing, I'm joking, I'm drinking, I'm sniffing. I'm okay with people around me. And then the realisation that I'm going to my mum's house in a a room on my own, influenced heavily by drugs and drink dark, dark places. But I I don't know where it was, you know, like I've sat over the woods crying, wanting to do fucking. I've never told anyone this, but trying and just wanting it to end, thinking about it deeply. But then I still asked myself the question was was it the drugs and the drink? Or was it you know, it it was influencing the suicidal thoughts, I think. And on a day to day when I was getting better I wasn't having those thoughts while I was sober and and straight-minded, if you know what I mean. It was while I was in heavily under the influence and shit was getting real. What stopped you, mate? Um, the one where I was sitting over the woods that time, sitting there like sobbing, like a a child, like I was sobbing. And um it was going through my head and going through my head. I was looking at it and just thinking to myself, and a couple comes walking down the path behind the farm with a dog. And I just thought, I've gotta get out of here, man. I need to get home like so. That was the closest where I was it was really going through my head, and it was a scary time after as well, because even after that, the day, well, it might have been the day half a day after when I'd slept and sobered up, I woke up, and even then I was like, what the fuck? Do you know what I mean? Like, what am I doing? Then it could be a day after, or the sat it could even be the same day. I'd be back in the pub and sniffing again just to get through the day. Do you know what I mean? So when I talk about it like this, I know I sound a bit going off, but I'm realising at the same time as talking to you, and fucked up things really was.
SPEAKER_01So yeah, it's it was a mad time, mad time. It's funny you say that, mate, about the couple coming through with the dog and sort of breaking that suicidal cycle, right? And I had a guest called George Gabriel, who was gonna take his own life on a mountain, and a guide came over to him and just offered him a chocolate bar, and it was something as simple as that that just broke the cycle of suicidal thoughts. Do you share any commonality with that?
SPEAKER_03Um, I don't know. With me, I see it as a as a sort of a sign, like, you know what I mean, like someone coming and it's not your time. Like it was literally like being woke up, that's how it was. It was like it snapped me out of it. And it's like I needed to go home and rest. Do you know what I mean? I needed to go home. Well, usually I would carry on drinking how many times I've gone through rest and that didn't apply to me. If I had drinking drugs, I didn't want rest. I'd go for days. So that one I'd actually thought I need to go home and try and sleep. Do you know what I mean? And yeah, it was like a w a wake up more than anything.
SPEAKER_01You're still stuck in this cycle of addiction, self-harm, self-destruction. You split up with your wife several times more, get back together, split up again, you promise to quit, you relapse, cycle continues. At this point, she could have easily said no, enough is enough now. Why do you think she stayed? Could she see something in you that you couldn't, perhaps the Danny speaking to me now?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I think that's what it was. She said it to me on many occasions, like you know, when things are good, they're good. And um I was always supportive to my family, but in the wrong way, I always provided I wasn't present. So I always worked hard, and I think when I told her, when I was on a dent and I was being truthful that I was gonna change, I believed it. She'd have doubt, obviously, but she wanted to believe it. I think that's how the cycle went, because she even said, like when we get back together, sometimes when we'd split up, I'd phone her, say Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, you know, pouring out my heart, I want you back, I want you that, and she'd say, Then Danny, sometimes Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday, you wouldn't message me then because you're doing what you were doing. You won't give a shit, you know what I mean? But eventually I'd get my way back in there and try and work on it, then I'd end up having a shandy, then it was a light beer, then it was back to square one.
SPEAKER_01Let's fast forward to a positive now recovery. It's 2024. When was the moment in that year you felt like you had the strength to quit alcohol, but most importantly, as we've just discussed, do it for good this time.
SPEAKER_03Um I think it was mainly changing my circle, bruv. So when I wanted to quit and I went there, I was still thinking not thinking, but there was a doubt. I was still in doubt of um messing up again. So when I went there and surrounded myself with the people, I spoke to Jamie Lewis, who was part of the man them who run the circle at Eathown, and he was the first person I'd ever spoke to who was the same as me. And he was three years clean at that time, and you know, we spoke and he says it was just exactly the same, and it was the first person who'd ever been positive about it because I don't put bad on my mates here, like the ones I grow up, I still love them to a bit too. I used to go out with drinking and session with, but they'd all make a joke of it. Oh, when you're back, you know, I'll come out, you know what I mean? Like even I went on a stad doing the you know, the sniffing and stuff like that, and they're saying, Are you having one or what? Do you know what I mean? Where this side of it with a man is total opposite. It's you can do this, you know. That's the biggest thing with a mandem. We've got people who have been through it, and that's what I needed. People who've been through not says you can do you can do this, but people saying, 'I've done this, like do that makes sense, like that they've lived it, they've done it.' It's real then to me. I can literally believe that because it's real. So yeah, that was a time when I thought, I can go, I can do it still don't. I still have days where I have, you know, visions of me drinking, and I could see people buying drinks in the pub, or because people buying drinks in the and I look at it and I think, I've got cane that, but they're just thoughts, bro.
SPEAKER_01Like, no. You said to me off air, bro, I was sick of being sick, and that's the exact phrase friend of the pod, Earl John Charlton, said on his pod when he was quitting all sorts of addictions that he had. Unpack that phrase for me.
SPEAKER_03I was run down, so I was working, and I was working to not progress, I was working to get my weekly wage and get through the day. Even in my work bands or whatever, the first thing I'd do when I finished work was crack a beer. I had to level out. I didn't drink in work time, but every day I was hanging and feeling run down, tired, and I think age was catching up as well. Because when I was younger and I was drinking on on a regular, I was running still, I was playing football, you know, I was playing for teams. In one in one programme, it even said you know we got to a final, and in the programme of the match was Danny Grady, you know, a great player when he turns up sober. And I look back at that now and it's it's funny then. And now it's like embarrassing, you know what I mean? So everything was starting to catch up with me. Um it was just run down, tired, embarrassed, stinking as well. You know, like sometimes I and someone would say, Fucking hell, you had a drink last night, yeah. I'd have that on a daily, do you know what I mean? And I think vanity was starting to kick in as well. Belly was coming. I mean, I've still got a bit of a belly, but bruv, I'll send you some pictures, man. It looked like I had a football up my top, it was getting bad.
SPEAKER_01One of the hallmarks of addictive behaviour, mate, is a victim mentality, right? So you're causing this damage to yourself, you're self-harming, but when people try and point it out to you, you think it's an attack on you, you think the world's against you, right? But then at the same time, you're also playing the role of perpetrator in the damage that you're causing to them on your relationships, on your friendships, on your loved ones, on your work, every area of life. When did you come out of victimhood mentality, mate?
SPEAKER_03So, probably after talk circles and stuff, things like that, where taking responsibility for my actions, that was a big thing to learn. Yeah, that's when it began for me, like. Listening to people in talk circles. There was further on in the journey for me, and there was forgiving themselves, but also paying back like writing letters to people or saying they were sorry and stuff like that was was sitting with me and yeah, as I started to realise then that it was on me.
SPEAKER_01Something you mentioned there, mate, just literally brings me on to my next question, which is I had a previous guest called Luke Laughlin, who, an incredible bloke and incredible brother, who spoke about his addiction. And when he went into recovery, he did this kind of apology tour, right? Where he wrote letters, called people he had wronged and embarrassed on potential family occasions, stuff like this. Did you do something similar or did you kind of do it more internally? Family-wise, yes.
SPEAKER_03On a whole, I started like probably people thought this was just bombarding with the work I was doing, and the inboxes I have on Facebook, like, is lovely, man. I've people I know, but I started publicly putting out videos of my work with Amandan. So I was putting out where I was, little just cap cuts with you know the memes, and then it'd have videos with stuff I was doing with Amandem. That was sort of my way of showing people, you know, there were messages like about wronging and all that sort of stuff, people I'd wronged, or people I'd done this to, or there was just all sorts of videos, but it was on a whole, really. You have messages off people all the time when you do this sort of stuff with Amandem and it's public. So I'll have messages off people on weekends, on Sunday mornings who would say, Oh, I need to get on this with you, I need to do this, I need to do that. At the start, I'd give them so much information, bro. This is this, do this, do that, you know. You need to come with me, you need to do that. And then I learned they was doing what I was doing, it was just they were on a down and get back on itself. Unfortunately, what I have to do now, instead of wasting my time and giving them someone just to bounce off while they're probably still a bit under the influence of Coke and that, I have to just say, when you're ready, bro, I'm here because it was just going on too much in the end. People I knew was uh was using me as someone to talk to, I think, while they was sniffed up. But um that'd say why I showed people that I'd changed through that sort of stuff, through social media and stuff like that, yeah.
SPEAKER_01You said the penny dropped, mate, when you said it was the first time it was me making the choice, not being forced into it. Why was that distinction important? Was it that first kind of little creak in the door that opened to you owning it yourself?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I think it was obviously it was a coincidence that it's where I've started the circle and that as well, but it was me who'd made the I wasn't like getting threatened to get kicked out by my wife to my mum's or anything. Because what made it hard for me as a as a drunk, what people don't understand is they didn't think I had a problem because I wasn't an aggressive drunk. I was fun, I was dancing, I was singing. The one who seen all the shit really was my family. The closest ones to me was the ones who had the shit part of me. That's what my wife used to say, like, I get all the shit. They all think, oh Dan's this, Danny's that, do you know what I mean? And then I get all the shit of you. So yeah, I think doing it on my own where I wasn't in trouble was it could have been just a coincidence that it was the time I went to the circle, but it was also the time where I'd thought, enough's enough. I'm sick and tired of being tired. Um I need something needs to change, I can't keep going like this. Not just with a drink, the mental issues with the vanity as well. I didn't want to be the blow who you see with a big belly hanging out, and I didn't want to go out down that route. I wanted to be a fit dad, I wanted to be the blow who played football with his kids in the park, who went on walks with a family, and everything just come. All the thoughts have been there for a long time, but everything just went into action at that time, bro.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Let's dive into that first talking circle you went to, mate, because you mentioned it so many times already. So it's 11th of February, 2024. You go through the doors, you sit down, and when it comes to you, you cry amongst those men in that safe space. Just tell me about that moment and the build-up and what was behind those tears for you.
SPEAKER_03I think all of that that I've spoken about, all the times, every time where I'd wanted to stop while I was still drinking and under the influence, all of that emotion, everything of letting my family down, the guilt of being selfish. I was set I was a selfish man. All of it just hit me like a ton of bricks. Because I'd heard other people's what they'd shared as well. And that's the thing with the talk circle. I think if I'd have gone first or second, I probably wouldn't have spoke. I'd suggest to people if you go into a talk circle, especially one that's set up like the man, then we're literally in a circle and we pass the stick round and it's your turn to talk while you've got that stick. No one can console you, which is good because it'd probably stop me from talking. When you've got that stick, you talk. No one could say, Do you want a tissue? Put their hand on you, anything. You're just left to let everything out. And that is the best way a talk circle can go. Because I think if somebody says, Yeah, Danny, do you want a tissue? or Are you okay, mate? It'll be alright. I'd have probably just stopped and I wouldn't have cried, and I'd probably have gone, got a breath and gone, Yeah, yeah, I'm sound. I'm all right, I'm alright. Where because you've got that stick and you've got to keep going, I was just like fixated looking at that stick, and it was like I was the only one in the room, bro. Like I just spoke and the truth came out, and it just tears followed and bumped, and I just let go, man. Just let go of everything. The crazy thing is about that, when I was driving home, I felt like the weight of the world had come off my shoulders. Driving home, the phone rings. I'm like, oh, it's my wife, I answer the phone. Hello, you alright? Where are ya? Where you been? Because obviously she just made me cry. I was like, oh man, shit. I was feeling on top of the world, then you just brought me down. But obviously, this is still fresh. So she's got in her mind, has you gone to the pub after, or was it a lie to get to the pub? Because that's what I did. So yeah, yeah, it's a mad, mad time, mad start of the journey.
SPEAKER_01We spoke about pennies dropping earlier, mate. Like you said, your wife initially wasn't too sure about Mandem. She might have thought you were using it as a cover for all the lies you had previously told. When did the penny drop for her that this was actually helping you and she could see it helping you and obviously helping her and your kids at the same time as a result?
SPEAKER_03Well, at the start, I was probably with me when I start something, I'm all in. If it's golf, I'm gonna buy all the stuff. Do you know what I mean? So when I go there, I'm trying to take so much at once. So I'm listening to ten different men where as you go on in your journey, you've got to find your own individual journey, haven't you? But I was trying to learn so much so quick. So I was going home and bombarded, you know, I've got to do this, I've got to do that, I've got to go with the gym, I've got to do this meditation, I've got to do this breath work, I've got to go up this mountain, I've got and she's like, what you want about? Like, what you what you're doing? So yeah, at the start, she's like, We're gonna see you less than we did when you was going out drinking. And then that's when, as the journey went on, my journey was my family. So now, if the lads at football say to me, the family, I'm like, bro, family first. If there's something for Mandem, whatever it is, if my wife says we want to go here with the kids, I've got this planned and that bam, that's dropped. Family first. That's my journey now. Do you know what I mean? Like it's uh it's where I am in my life, it's what I'd expect all the lads in my position who've let the family and that down so many times. And Mandem say this we want our family to want you to come here. So if you're putting Mandem before your family, they're gonna sort of think that's something holding you back from them. Balance is the key. So yeah, when I started having balance and I was putting her first, you believed me then that I was putting the family before anything, and that's when the penny dropped for her that I'm serious that that I'm changing.
SPEAKER_01You are now two years clean from alcohol at time of recording. Two and a half years. Two and a half years, sorry. What's been key to that?
SPEAKER_03Um it's not something they're gonna hear on this podcast, so there's a selfish thing behind me helping others. Like when I do the talk circles and that I say to lads, I wouldn't want to become in there knowing I'd had a drink or something, do you know what I mean? And also what I say when my talk circles is I'm here as much as you it just happens, I've got the keys. So I don't think I'm in charge of this or anything like that. I am here to use these services as much as as you are, but big one helping people helps me. So if I'm talking to a lad who being in the same position as me, who's young, I love it when they're like 90, not 20, 21. You know, if they're gonna be consistent and stick to it, that's perfect. Like we've had young lads who have come and they're working there and they're helping with a youth them and that stuff feeds me, man. It's it just keeps me going. I don't want to be an hypocrite and drink or take drugs and then go there and do you know what I mean? I want to live true. So, although it's me who wants to live it, a big, big help in that is helping others because I'm not gonna go there and be full of shit. I'm gonna be telling them how I'm living and be true to that. So, yeah.
SPEAKER_01You said to me off air, it's sad it took me 40 years to find out who I really am. But you're here now, mate. That's what's important. Who's the Danny sitting here now?
SPEAKER_03Oh mate, it's someone who's I'm going through our tough times at the moment, but if ever those tough times was gonna come, I'm happy it was now because I'm there, I'm present, I'm present for my wife, I'm present for my kids, present for my granddaughter and a granddaughter on the way. Yeah, I'm the person I want to be, I'm I'm happy with who I am, you know. Not saying everything's perfect, obviously sometimes my missie still wants to have a go at me, you know. It's not a fairy tale. We have our tough times, you know, as you do, but I'm in a position to to accept those tough times and apologise. I can look at myself and say, do you know what? Yeah, I was I was in the wrong and I can go and apologize for that, or in the very rare occasion I I was right. I could say that you know, I think I was right, I I don't know what I've done. Do you know what I mean? So yeah, I can talk about these things rather than scream and get to the pub.
SPEAKER_01And before you reflect, you're the father of five kids. Grandfather, yeah, granddaughter, granddaughter on the way. Where do you think you'd be without your wife?
SPEAKER_03Oh, it'd have been a mess, bro. Without my wife completely, I think uh a lot of my friends who I grew up with now I would have ended up locked up. Guaranteed, the stupid stuff I was doing. Yeah, I'd I'd be in a pit. I'd be uh down and out. I don't even like to think about it, bro, because she stood by me, man, and that's what I'm gonna do for her for our entire life. We've old and wrinkly together, man, just talking about the times and the good times. Sometimes you can reflect on the bad times. Some of the bad times can become stories that led me on to the good times, so you know it's it's a life story in it, and there's ups and downs in those stories. There's chapters, and at the minute the chapter's a bit of a sad one, and uh it's putting me on a downer, but at the same time, we're gonna fight through it and we're gonna get there, man. It's the book's gonna finish with an happy ending, bro, man.
SPEAKER_01And as he reflects, a similar question as the last one. If it wasn't for Mandem, where do you think you'd be?
SPEAKER_03Probably back in the pub drinking, bro, because my social circle was the only one I knew was uh was going to the pub and talking to the lads who would say, have a drink, eh? Things will be alright. You'll be alright, that's all you ever heard of, lads in the pub. Yeah, it'll be alright. And you're having a point and uh there's one in there for you, a line, you know, like everything will be alright. Where with a mandem, it's it's true, like it's not a magic one, the mandem is a magic one, you've got to want it. They haven't made me this person. What they are is a support network who's supported me to be the person I want to be. That's took me, and that's what it is when you come to the mandem. Don't think you're gonna come and we're gonna go, you know, wait this one down, yeah, yeah, you're sound. You've got to want it, you've got to put the work in, and you've got to listen to the advice whether you like it or not. You know, we have lads who come, they think they're alright, they disappear for a bit. You know, it's just a vicious circle, they come back, but they will always be welcome back, you know, there's no expectations at the man damage. If you fall off the wagon, we're not gonna say, oh my god, I can't believe you've done that. It's gone. You're back, let's start again, you know what I mean? And that's what it's it is with me. Just thankfully, I haven't fell off or anything like that, but I just feel the support there so strong.
SPEAKER_01What has this mental health journey taught you about yourself, mate?
SPEAKER_03Mental health and the journey, it's I've only felt the mental health side of it and stuff like that since. You know, recognising it since I've been on my sober journey and the journey of you know, when I get thoughts, thoughts are only thoughts. That's a it's a big one with me, you know, and it's just recognising, catching yourself before things happen, I think, is my mental health. Like sometimes I can feel down, I can feel like I'm sleeping, or anything like that, and that's usually days where I'm sitting doing nothing. I start to slip and things. So, yeah, I recognise that you know depression and stuff hate to moving target. And luckily, my wife, I'd say my wife and the kids love walks. Me and my wife like the walks, the kids are alright once they get them out on them. They don't like them so much when we're telling them that they've gotta come, but once they're on them, they love them. So recognising mental health when it's starting to set in, when I'm getting temptations, when I'm getting thoughts of being down, it's catching them and doing something productive.
SPEAKER_01And as a final question, if you could go back and talk to the Danny who was sitting in that pub time after time, relapsing, the Danny who was sitting in those woods suicidal, or the Danny who was thinking about joining Mandem and stepping into the doors of that talking circle for the first time, what would you say to him knowing what you do now, if anything at all, mate?
SPEAKER_03I'd say the only people that you need uh for them to think anything of you, or you need them to look up to you, or you need to please, is the ones who love you because all of my arguments uh with my wife was because she wanted me there, you know, and all of the reasons was because I wanted to be with people who who weren't who weren't doing any good as much as I like them than my mates, you know, I don't want to say I'm bad, but there was nothing productive coming from it, you know. The people I was scared to miss out of, there was really nothing to miss out of. I could have had two years, three years, four years off. I could go back tomorrow and I guarantee it'll be the same night I had when I was 18, 19. So I'd say to Danny, Danny, you're missing fuck or be the family man that you've always wanted to be, man.
SPEAKER_01We've talked about your incredible mental health journey, mate. You've mentioned it a lot already, but now let's focus on all the incredible work you do with Mandem Meetup Wolves. So you're not just a participant and member, service user, but you lead the football team. You've taken over from Brother Lee. How did you get more involved with Mandem beyond just a service user, bro? And tell me about your relationship with Brother Lee as well, because it sounds pretty special.
SPEAKER_03Oh, Lee, Lee's an amazing guy, man. He's uh he's someone who's an inspiring character, isn't he? So his story is amazing. Uh I think going further into Mandem was my consistency. So even when I felt like I was better and I was being because what the Mandem says is we don't want to just hear your downfall, we want to hear your wins. And my wins was taking over my downfalls, but yet I was still consistent at talk circles, consistent at working workouts, consistent I's a bit it and miss with me because I've got a caravan in Wales as well, so I'm away most weekends. The lads all piss themselves when they hear me say that because there's a running joke there. What you ain't got a caravan, have you? You don't like to talk about that, do you? It's all I talk about. So uh yeah, it was being consistent.
SPEAKER_01We've spoken about talk circles. You did one as a service user, now you're the facilitator of them. Tell me about that transition, mate, because it's a big responsibility, isn't it?
SPEAKER_03Well, I took over the talk circle that I went to for help originally, and it was exactly two years to the day of me stopping, and that that was just coincidence. But the way I do the talk circle is um straight away, like we spoke about earlier in the chat, is I explained to them that I'm a user of the man dem just as much as you. Don't think because you know I'm sitting here holding the space that I don't need the space. The thing is with a man, we're all here to support each other, and sometimes facilitators can get overlooked in that, like Christian, like Lee, Jamie, or people won't reach out to them and ask them if they're okay because they presume they are because they're facilitating. So I'll try and get across straight away that I'm also a user of the service just as much as a facilitator for it or a person who's holding space for you.
SPEAKER_01I have a phrase I use often on this podcast, which is support pillars need support too. Yeah, it's bang on. As well as the talk circles, you've got the football team. Tell me about that, bro, because it's a really big passion project, isn't it?
SPEAKER_03Yes, brilliant. So we've just come back. I took a team, I organised a game in Wales against Borth United. Yeah, I organised that. It was stress all the way up to the last day, complete stress. But we took 18 lads uh, and uh it was it was a good one because I don't think they expected a men's mental health team to turn up like that. They was beating us one nil at half tire, and uh they're together. We did breath work before the game, which is all a man den thing, you know. So they must have looked over thinking, what the fuck are these guys doing? We sat in a circle while they was warming up doing breath work, and second half, they're togetherness shows the man then brotherhood we beat them 5-1. And they're still ongoing, man. There's such talent there that comes through the doors. The lads, you have to be man, you know, like football is football, you're always gonna have hard challenges, you're always gonna have disagreements. That's fine. It's how you deal with them like life, you know, like football is like life, you know, people are gonna kick you, people are gonna try and rustle your feathers, or it's how you deal with that, it's how you take that on and how you respond to it. And and in football, trust me, when you respond in a way where you're not being aggressive or you're not kicking off back, that gets in their head a lot more, and it can help you as a team and it can help you learn that in life that people don't have the right to manage your move. That's your right, it's your head.
SPEAKER_01You own that. You've also started a monthly darts night at time of recording. Now, I constantly say to people when I big up Mandem, and what it does is that it's more than a charity, it's community, it's connection, it's family. Is that what it means for you?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, as much as doing all the inner work and the workouts, you need socialising as well. So I knew a lad who I played football with, he's the captain of the golf club at the Mount Golf Club. He reached out to me and offered me a space, so I went along there. We had a look, me and Christian was like, yeah, it was running ideas, what we could do. I fought the darts straight away. And uh Jamie Hall loves his darts. I thought there's no one better than Jamie Hall to hold that space. Do you know what I mean? It's it was good for him. Plus, I couldn't take much more on because my wife, I think Jamie Hall's missus is a bit more forgiving than my missus. Like, uh if I'm at the house, I'm way at the house way too much. So yeah, Jamie Hall's running down, it's beautiful, it's growing. And a big thank you to the Mount Golf Club for that as well, because that's what we need. We need support from the community. A big shout out to um Borth United who took us there, they gave us food, they paid for the referee, they gave us 170 quid after the game to cover all our costs. You know what I mean? It's community, it was beautiful.
SPEAKER_01I read a book by Max Dickens' mate called Billy Nomates this year. And now, whilst I wasn't enamoured with a lot of the messaging in the book, one thing I did love is that he talks about how bad men are at organising, right? I think me and you are anomalies and that we're quite good at organising. Yeah. And you always need one shepherd to herd the sheepdogs. Do you feel like a shepherd now, where previously you might have been a sheepdog and maybe even before Mandem you were a sheep?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, definitely. I was always wanted to feel like I belonged, but now I get so many ideas. Jamie Dennis must think fucking hell here's another message off Danny because I bombard him with stuff, honestly. Like, you know, some of it comes through. No, I've got golf on my head, so I want to play golf at the minute. So now I'm thinking if I reach out to a golf club, I could get us a little area, we can go to the driving range and talk and swing and golf the message to me is what I wanted to put across to the lads. I put a big list of things, but one of the big ones is integrity with golf. You're counting your shots, you're the one in the bush, and that goes into life. Do you know what I mean? The important work is the work that no one sees and being true to yourself, and that's golf. You could walk up there and swing 10 and go on the green and say, four, who you're lying to, no one but yourself. So it's important to do the things that no one sees. I'm starting to realise now, and so that message is coming through because I want to play golf, and I'm gonna tell because I want to play golf, that message could come through golf, or I put it out in the chat as a little idea, and people love the idea of. It so I've asked Jamie if I can have a little driving range at the HQ.
SPEAKER_01What's shone through on this podcast, mate, is that you certainly, and it's obvious because you had an addiction, is that you have an addictive personality or certainly traits of it right. But what has shone through in this last answer is that you've now channelled it in the right way. Would that be a fair summary?
SPEAKER_03Definitely, yeah. That's I think that's something that my missus has to say as well. You swap one addiction for another, but at least this one's positive, bro. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. So yeah, I'd have to agree with it. I don't recognise it as such, but people would say I get obsessed with things that I want to do. Do you know what I mean? If even if it's we're having a car or if it's whatever it is, um my missus is convinced that I have ADHD. She's like, you know, cupboard doors open, all this stuff. Um I've got an idea to do something in the morning. By the time the afternoon comes, it's the worst thing I could ever think of in my life. Do you know? Like, it's she's like, You are mad. I haven't been to the doctor or anything with it because I just think I'm alright the way I am, but you know, yeah, people would say, I definitely go obsessed with things.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean, some people don't need a diagnosis, and some people do, mate. I'm very watched on this podcast when it comes to that. What you said there is exactly what previous guest Scott Johnson said, who runs another amazing men's mental health organization called the Proper Blokes Club, and he said when he was addicted to alcohol and gambling, he's replaced them now with positive addictions, exactly the phrase you did. His positive addiction is now the proper bloke club, it's running, it's doing half marathons. He's obviously got to keep that in balance and check, and he's probably got a similar personality to you too, mate. But how do you keep the positive addiction as well in check, too? Apart from the missus being the check.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah. Well, 100%. So I'll balance weekends from like March to October through seasons when we we go away, more or less every weekend we're down on the beach and stuff like that. That is a promise, do you know what I mean? So it's balance, it's all about balance. If something does come up, even if it's last minute and it's family, it's family. So that's how I balance things is like we had a game set up, a match ready to be played last week against Leo. My wife was feeling down with what she's going through at the minute. And there's a young lad with us now who's Tom Fozzie, Foster, but we call him Fozzie, and Jay Hall. I says, lads, can you take the reins for me? I'm going away for the weekend, just me and the wife. We're gonna have some time together, and I think that's how I control things. She needed me, and I'm there, like she was for me. When I was down and I was in the dumps, and no one gave a shit, she was there, and if she's going through a bit of a bad time there, and I'm there and I'm serious about being there.
SPEAKER_01Let's reflect on Mando now, mate. What's been your proudest achievement as part of it so far?
SPEAKER_03Um the proudest, proudest achievement is my consistency, I'd say, you know, it's yeah, I'm a consistent person, but as a whole like seeing the lads at football makes me proud, the change in them and like lads who come to us who would not talk, who was in the south, seeing them screaming for a ball and you know, lads jumping on them when they get a goal. Or I know to people who don't like football, some people would think, is it mental health, you know, like is what's it about? Yeah, I've heard it off people who who are in Mandem who who aren't all football, they're like, Oh, they don't come to anything else, or they don't do this, but it's their safe space. Some people do it through different things, it's their therapy, mate. It's their therapy, exactly, and it's probably an odd thing to explain to someone who doesn't play football or anything like that. At the same time, I wouldn't turn around and say to anyone, you're not doing anything else, you're not coming here. Because it's their safe space, and and seeing people grow is a proud moment. Like what Lee started, I fell out in love with football, I haven't kept the ball for three years. The moment I went there and started playing with the lads, it brought it all back. I played 90 minutes in that friendly manner, and that was hard work. I was proud of myself to get through 90 minutes. I couldn't walk for three days after, but yeah, the persistency and you know, just the growth of people, man, that makes me proud to be holding a space where I see people grow.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I remember saying this to Lee, you know, me and Lee got a great relationship and friendship. We've never met in real life, but it almost feels like we're sort of old uni mates, like we've known each other for like 12, 13 years, and what I love about Lee is that he's got this ability to not just in a football sense but in a personal sense, bring out the best in people. Is that what you would say is his best quality?
SPEAKER_03100% like he'll reach out to me. I've gone to Lee's just to pick stuff up, and he's like, You okay, bro? He like can see, man, he can see, he could recognise. I'm like, Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm just tired or something, but really, like, you know, it was stuff going on, you know. I didn't really want to share on his doorstep as such, but he recognised, do you know what I mean? And that's what it is with Lee. Lee can recognise things in people, and he can like when I was going to the football for him, I've always said it, like I said it in an interview with one of the Mandem lads when he interviewed me at the training session. I says, This football will always be Lee's. I'm just looking after it, you know. Whenever Lee's ready to come back, I'm just happy that he trusted me with it. So, yeah, to me and to the lads I let on now, man, the football will always be Lee's. Whatever happens, it's Lee's football, do you know what I mean? But I'm happy, more than happy to be the foster parent.
SPEAKER_01And as a final question before we move on, what has been part of the mandem in the last two and a half years taught you about yourself as well, mate?
SPEAKER_03I know it's a cliche that you hear a lot, but it is okay not to be okay, that bad things will happen, but it's how you deal with them. So it's recognising that. I think a lot of people need to recognise that when you're feeling down and that that ain't a time to go and grab the bottle or grab a bag of coke or weed or wherever their voices have a better, whatever it may be. That's the times where you sit and and think and and give yourself a pat on the back that you can get through it, you know. Like that you are a warrior. A warrior is a big thing as well, do you know what I mean? Like when we used to do work-in, workouts, and that that's what it's about with the bits of boxing. So that was our workout. Then we'd do our work-in, which was the meditation. So the workout is good, you need to be fit and ready, and that keeps you in check. You know, it's just as important to have your inner work, and that's where it all works and comes together as your inner work, and realizing that stuff is gonna be bad, but that's when if you're consistent with your inner work and stuff, you can get through it, man.
SPEAKER_01Our final topic of conversation, Danny, on this amazing conversation is one I have with every special guest. It is a general natter, lightning round, quickfire chat about our mental health. So, firstly, bro, how is your mental health out of 10?
SPEAKER_03I'd say, oh my god, I was gonna say six, seven, then a muck it's come into my head. I'd say I'd say like a seven, yeah.
SPEAKER_01What age were you, mate, when you became self-aware of your mental health and you realised that the feelings you were having weren't physical and they were actually in your mind?
SPEAKER_03I'd say when I got sober, bro, like 40 years old is when I reflected on everything because without the drugs and alcohol, I didn't have anything to blame. So going through it before, I'd just put it down to I'm on a donor, where now if I'm sober and I'm feeling it, it's real.
SPEAKER_01Can you tell me about the first or the most important conversation you've had with someone about your mental health? So who is it with? What did you say, and what impact did it have? Did it feel like the stereotypical big weight had been lifted, or on the other, something quite easy and normal to do?
SPEAKER_03I've had it with my wife quite a few times. I've poured out, obviously, she's the closest person to me. She's listened and she's took on board. But I think sometimes you take more from from like, say, when I was at that talk circle, because it's a stranger, and if they can be supportive and understand, like it it sinks in that little bit, you know, like they had answers for me where my wife was being loving and caring for me. They was giving me the truth and and what I needed to do. So yeah, it's probably the talk circle was was a big change when I spoke to Jamie Lewis, the person who'd lived it and been through it.
SPEAKER_01What things do you find in life, mate, if any, that trigger your mental health? So it could be things people say to you, it could be a sound, a smell, a taste being in a particular environment, or have you not figured all of them out yet?
SPEAKER_03I have triggering things like obviously I still go to pubs with my family, I still want to be around them and they still drink, they haven't got a problem with alcohol, you know what I mean? So why would I not go and spend time with them there and stuff? So, you know, I have time when I look at points, I look at drinks and stuff like that. And then on the other side of it, I think when you're on a journey and you start to feel like you want to be peaceful and you want to be in a good place, what really winds you up is people who do stuff out of spite and people who are just general freaks, do you know what I mean? Like they come across and they're trying to rustle feathers as much as I want to be peaceful and stuff like that. I feel like a lot of the time I have to get that off my chest. You're gonna say, 'What's your plan?' Think about how other people are feeling, do you know what I mean? That's the thing, having other people's feelings, being mindful about how they are when you're rustling these feathers, do you know what I mean? So even if it's a wind up and it's a joke, if I don't like it where I'd have gone along with it in my older days these days, I'll back away from it and be like, it's going too far now, or I might look miserable, but it's how I feel.
SPEAKER_01And conversely, what positive tools do you use to improve your mental health or help you feel better? Which ones have worked for you and which ones have you tried but haven't?
SPEAKER_03Um, I haven't really tried any that haven't. I've been quite lucky in that sense. What does work for me is being around positive people. What has worked for me now is not just like as it's gone into over two years, is people recognising that I'm not just on a another thing that's uh I'm obsessed about, this is real, this is my real life. No, I'm I'm sober. So yeah, what works for me is if people say to me, uh, do you think you'll ever drink again? A lot of the time I won't say no, I say, I don't know, but I'm not gonna drink now. But my now is different to their now, so my now comes from the power of no, do you know, like no's the only thing that's real, and the next time they ask me, that'll be no as well. Do you know what I mean? So yeah, they might think, okay, so we might have a drink again, but my now is different to their now.
SPEAKER_01It's crazy that you brought up the power of now, mate, because it's actually on my shelf to start reading at some point. Brilliant. It's a book that's come up so many times on this podcast, actually. So this brings me on to my next question. Would you say it's the best book you've read for your mental health, or has there been something else?
SPEAKER_03No, 100%. I'd say that's one that stuck with me anyway, where I still have it on my um audio as well. Every now and again, even though I've read it, because I did something different with it as well. I actually listened to Enoch Tully read it and read it at sort of the same time. Because with me I I struggle to keep my concentration, so if I could be reading a page and all of a sudden I'm probably thinking about what I'm doing for tea or what I'm having, I think, oh man, I've just read the page and I've taken nothing from it. So sometimes I need the words going through as much as I do the reading and going out things. Yeah, I'd suggest it to anybody. One of my friends said it to me, it helped them buy their first house the book, did you know what I mean? It was that powerful to them.
SPEAKER_01So if there was a mantra in life that summed up your mental health, what would it be and why?
SPEAKER_03Um, probably the quote is like the only thing that's real is me and you talking now. This is the only thing that exists. So whatever happened in the past, we can't do anything about. Whatever's gonna happen in the future, we can't do anything about. So do your best now. Now's the time to to stop drinking. Now's the time to go for that run. Now's the time to tell the people who you love you love them because now's the only time that is real. So yeah, I'd say it's from the pair of now, it's something that sits, you know, it's nothing else is real but me and you having this conversation, do you know what I mean? So just make the best of the present. What do you love about yourself? I love that that I've been consistent, I love that I've been strong. I know it seems selfish to a lot of people, but ultimately you have to put yourself first because if you're not in a good place, you've got nothing to give to the ones around you. So I hear off a lot of people, it's not a bad thing, I know they believe it, but they say I'd die for my kids. And I look and I think you won't even live for 'em. So where would you die from? And living from is much easier. Do you know what I mean? So that's something I've thought about before. I'm thinking if you really would die from, then live for them, man. Stop the drinking, stop the drugs.
SPEAKER_00That is so powerful, man. Wow. Just give me a moment to sort of process that.
SPEAKER_01On that amazing note, as a final question, bro, you can answer this any way you want. What more do you think we have to do to ensure men from all social classes, all backgrounds, all races, all creeds, all religions, all walks of life feel comfortable and safe in opening up about their mental health issues or just their general mental health, if most importantly, they want to do it.
SPEAKER_03Perhaps this is something that another one that I've gone off with, you know, with this I like to have ideas, but I think we concentrate as a whole in like, no, it's good that we're concentrating on helping people to fix their mental health and that, but a lot of people won't come because they don't admit they've got a problem. So I see like, you know, prevention is better than cure. So getting that message across to people that come along and learn these tools in case something goes wrong, and you'll find a lot of the men who come through hopefully have got the problem, but they don't need to admit it now because they're going in case something happens. Do you know what I mean? Like they could say, Yeah, no, I'm alright, but I'm good in case, but really they're getting the foot in the door because ultimately men are still being very stubborn, like for the help. I think, do you know what I mean? Like I speak to some blokes and I think you would thrive in the mandate, but it's making that first step. That's something that that I think would be good to like set up something where it's I know we are a well-being charity and you know, the mental health and getting the message out of prevent prevention is better than cure and getting in there, just learning the tools you need for when life will throw you that hardball.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I say it often on this podcast, mate. There's too much in the mainstream about telling men to reach out if they're in crisis and not reaching in when they're in crisis, and also helping them not get to the crisis in the first place.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, 100%.
SPEAKER_01Danny brother, it has been an absolute pleasure to speak to you. Thank you so much for coming on the Just Checking In podcast and talking to me, bro.
SPEAKER_03Thank you for having me, bro. It's been a pleasure. It flew by as well.
SPEAKER_01Well, that's all we've got time for on this episode of the Just Checking In pod. A big thank you to Danny for being my special guest and for letting me check in with him. I'll put some links to where you can find out more about all the incredible work Mandem Meetup and its Wolves branch does, and follow them on social media in the show notes. As always, thank you to all the vendors who've checked in on this episode. If you've liked what you've heard, please do give it a share on social media by tagging us at eventhelpuk on all social media platforms. Tell your friends, family, or work colleagues about us. If you're feeling generous, please do write us a review and be kind and give us a five-star rating on Apple Podcasts. It really helps us out. If you like what we're doing and want to support us further, you can go to patreon.com slash eventshelpuk or make a one-off donation to our PayPal. Both those links are on our link tree. That's linktr.ee slash event helpuk. We hope to check in with you again very soon. And remember, guys, it's always okay to venture.
